Track recommendation please

For the purpose you describe, use Lionel Fast Track. Happy New Year!!!!!

I run tubular track around my tree as well, with but one lockon on each loop, although my ovals are a bit smaller than your largest. I wouldn't replace your track. It's part of the heritage of what you are running. I suspect it just needs some TLC.

Each year, as I am assembling the track, I take a pair of needle nose pliers and pinch every open rail end that's going to receive a pin, as well as any end with a loose pin. I clean the track by wiping with mineral spirits. My track has no rust on it, but if any of yours does, take it off with a scotchbrite pad first.  Ditto for any pins with rust. I bought most of my track used, and some of it needed work before it would perform, but this stuff was built tough for kids to play with, and it was built tough to last. I don't own plastic Fastback, but I doubt it will last anything close to the 80+ years some of the track I have that came with my sets originally has lasted.

Consider cleaning your locomotive pickup rollers and wheels with mineral spirits as well before you lube the engine.

My trains slow down somewhat at one point on the loop, but it's not the farthest from the lockon--it's just a few feet to the left of it. It's as if the electricity travels counterclockwise around the loop, and that spot is "farthest" from the transformer around the loop, although it is closer to the lockon than most of the loop. There is no surging of speed, though, the difference in speed isn't that great. There is a speed setting on the transformer that avoids both too slow and too fast, and that's where I set it.

I completely concur with @Ken Wing above.  Tubular track was built to withstand repeated disassembly, it can be easily repaired if necessary, and it is readily available at bargain prices.  Not only is newer track expensive, but it can have the same continuity problems that you're experiencing with tubular.  Keep the old-time vibe with tubular!

For my loop around the tree, I used 027 track clips (they're on the Bay).  They worked really well at keeping my old tubular track pieces held tightly together.  They can be a bit pricey, but probably less costly than replacing tubular with Fast Track.

I agree with Ken.  Clean the pickups, engine wheels, track, pins, etc., with scotchbrite and mineral spirits, and you should be good for another holiday season.

Happy New Year everyone!!

There is a pair of pliers with a dimple on the end, available at shows and hobby stores, to tighten pins on Lionel Track. It tightens up the pins, really good on O Gauge track but I use it on my O27 Track too. I also sand or clean the pins good.

@AlanWSNC posted:

I’m a Christmas train guy. Been setting up my train(s) at Christmas since I was a boy.  I’ve added to my original Lionel train set through the years and now have a couple Willliams diesel engines as well as my original Lionel 2055.  The trains only get out at Christmas.  So after Christmas the track is taken up and stored for another year.

Due to present space limitations I can only set up basically 2 ovals. The largest oval being about 8’ x 4’. I find the tubular track has several areas where the voltage drops so the speed of the train surges and then recedes in spite of me adding additional lockons placed around the track.  Most frustrating.

As you may expect I’m still using tubular O27 track which I know is obsolete.  I’m considering replacing my old track with something new. I want track which will best tolerate the annual assembly and disassembly.

Recommendations?

Thanks,  Alan

Hi Alan,

‘while fast track is great around the tree (I use it on my permanent layout and around tree) it can have some issues. First the pins are brittle and can break, also they can develop high resistance. While O-27 is no longer made you can step up to O-31 0r 36 in tubular track from either Menards or any hobby shop. Much easier to repair and troubleshooting is a snap.

One thing you should know about Fast Track is that it's very noisy.

So are real trains.

Two additions: I own a box of track clips, but never use them.

Needle nose pliers have tapered jaws. You push them in just far enough into the web of the rail to squeeze the round part of the rail closed a bit. For the center rail, you need to be above the insulator, so you are farther out than on the outside rails. You want it tight enough that there is some resistance to getting the pins in. If your track works apart when running, you need to squeeze some more. Track clips can mask this problem, because the rails aren't tight enough for good electrical continuity, but they don't come apart to tell you so.

From my perspective the key is cleaning the track as well as the engines, you need to be sure to clean all your wheels as well as pickup rollers as well as the track no matter what track you use.  And don’t forget to lube those engines as well. If you have the budget the Lionel fast track I think is the best pick.  You can even get the light up fast track to add some more light action if you like. If you want to keep it cheap the Menards option is very reasonable and easy to fix or replace as needed.  

Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions.  Actually I do clean the track every year with mineral spirits.  And I do use a pair of needle nose pliers to tighten the pins and the squeeze the openings to close them some for a tight fit.

However I have not cleaned the pins nor clean the rollers and wheels on the engines.  I will seek out the pliers made for tightening the pins on Lionel tubular track  

Thanks, Alan

Have any of you tried plastic cable ties (instead of track clips) to hold the track pieces together on carpet set ups ?

I have not either but wonder if cable ties would help

CB&Q Bill

Cable ties?  A different thought. Regarding track clips…I do tack down the track, it’s on a piece of plywood.

@PRRMP54 posted:

So are real trains.

I didn't know you could run real trains in your home

The information was provided so that a person can make a better informed selection, epically if there attaching the track to a wooden board. 

I have, and still use, some of the same tubular track that I bought in 1974!!!!  Like others have said, the stuff doesn't wear out.  I, like you, only have a Christmas layout so, like you, there's a LOT of disconnecting and re-connecting year after year.

One additional tip not mentioned above regarding pins:  Most of the newer, relatively speaking, tubular track has the track pinched so that removing the pins is very difficult.  That being the case, cleaning pins is typically only cleaning 1/2 of each one.  The part 'stuck' in the track doesn't get cleaned.  I have found that that black gunk that lands up dirtying the track can get 'pushed' inside the track and dirty the pin that's inside of it.

I have lot of track that doesn't have the pinch.  I have pulled every pin from those tracks and I have used an inexpensive rock cleaner/tumbler to clean them.  WOW, how shiny they come out.

I'd keep the tubular.  You have been doing things correctly in the cleaning department.  maybe the pin suggestion here will help - cleaning them by hand is a tedious process.

walt

@NYC 428 posted:

One thing you should know about Fast Track is that it's very noisy.

Yep!

@PRRMP54 posted:

So are real trains.

Yes, but they're not running around your Christmas Tree!

I’ll definitely pull the pins and clean them.  And get a pair of track pliers to get everything good and tight.

Thanks.

In the past, I would have recommended FasTrack for Christmas tree layouts because of its built-in roadbed (which helps keep carpet fibers out of mechanisms and locks the track sections together). But the repeated disassembly and reassembly does create electrical problems.

I still use it as my primary choice, but I tinker with the center pin and conductivity before assembly. If you’re running FasTrack on carpet, noise isn’t a problem.

MTH RealTrax is my second choice, but through repeated use it doesn’t stay together very well, and the metal tabs can become damaged.

My third choice is Lionel O-27 track. However, on carpet, it should be used with an alternative base (such as styrofoam, Homasote or plywood. And after repeated use at some point, the pins will create looser connections, so you’ll have to tinker to tighten those rail joints.

I just wish Lionel would improve its FasTrack, eliminating the brittle center-rail contacts with a strong conductive metal that bends but doesn’t break, and better locking tabs.

None of the alternatives are perfect.

Thanks for your thoughts. Based on your reply and the previous comments which I have received I’m sticking with tubular.

I don’t set up the track on carpet, but on plywood covered with a white bed sheet and then tack it down to prevent separations.

Based on the comments of others I need to make sure the pins are cleaned and tight and to clean the engine rollers and wheels.  

Trains can drip oil, so I have never set them up on carpet, even as a child. I have a large piece of red felt that goes over the carpet. The tree goes in the center, and after it's decorated, the trains go around it. The red is a nice Christmas color complementing the tree. I do not tack the track down or use track clips. That's why the pinching with pliers is important during the setup. I may have a joint or two that need a second pinch after operations begin, but that's small potatoes. My permanent layout is not the type where multiple trains just orbit, but for a few weeks each year, I enjoy watching my 1940 trains circle the tree at unrealistic speeds while gatemen, bells, crossing lights, crossing gate, and stations do their thing.

I had a severe rust problem with my O27 track about a year ago. I had to pull it all up and clean it. Quite a job. Scotch-Brite makes an industrial strength Scotch-Brite pad. Use that. Followed by mineral spirits. Followed by no ox, used very very sparingly. You will then be glad you have O27 Lionel tinplate track.

Lots of good inputs here.

I am also a temporary carpet engineer.

For roadbed I use Plywood or masonite cut as a roadbed under O31 track to protect from carpet lint.

Anything I acquire gets meticulously cleaned engines cars and track  (mineral spirits, gunk removal on wheels, and the track gets a wipe down of DeOxitD5 lightly). I am a big proponent of watching the polarity of cleaning methods for best conductivity .

Since take up and put down is a hassle, I design and make a box to hold the track and roadbed that will slip under a bed.  I use small zip ties on every track connection.  But when put away the zip ties are left on as many sections of track as possible—meaning it’s stored in three piece segments.

Also hate loud noises! So with my O31 track is fitted with an insulator (normal home roll foam weather stripping) under each tie.

Three families have these layouts now and counting. Great watching the enjoyment.

@Obuckler I like how the foam makes the ties solid, too.

Just want to repeat what others have said about Fastrack; that the pins break off.  I bought Fastract for my Christmas layout years ago and many sections now have broken pins.  

My layout around the Christmas tree and my permanent layout both use Fastrack.  I have had several broken pins (inner and outer) with Fastrack.   I keep a supply of replacement pins.  When a pin gets broken, I put that piece of track in a box.  Periodically, I take those pieces out and replace the broken pins.  Replacing the pins is pretty easy.

I place white shag carpet around the Christmas tree.  Using Fastrack on the shag carpet works very well.  It is pretty quiet and looks great.

Gargraves

@Ken Wing posted:

I run tubular track around my tree as well, with but one lockon on each loop, although my ovals are a bit smaller than your largest. I wouldn't replace your track. It's part of the heritage of what you are running. I suspect it just needs some TLC.

Each year, as I am assembling the track, I take a pair of needle nose pliers and pinch every open rail end that's going to receive a pin, as well as any end with a loose pin. I clean the track by wiping with mineral spirits. My track has no rust on it, but if any of yours does, take it off with a scotchbrite pad first.  Ditto for any pins with rust. I bought most of my track used, and some of it needed work before it would perform, but this stuff was built tough for kids to play with, and it was built tough to last. I don't own plastic Fastback, but I doubt it will last anything close to the 80+ years some of the track I have that came with my sets originally has lasted.

Consider cleaning your locomotive pickup rollers and wheels with mineral spirits as well before you lube the engine.

My trains slow down somewhat at one point on the loop, but it's not the farthest from the lockon--it's just a few feet to the left of it. It's as if the electricity travels counterclockwise around the loop, and that spot is "farthest" from the transformer around the loop, although it is closer to the lockon than most of the loop. There is no surging of speed, though, the difference in speed isn't that great. There is a speed setting on the transformer that avoids both too slow and too fast, and that's where I set it.

I agree with Ken here.  I also use Rail Zip on the pins before insertion, to aid in conductivity and initially as a lubricant since some joints are tight.  have not had problems with O27 since doing all the above.  Only slow down is through curves where wheel friction is highest.

@John C. posted:

Gargraves

That's what I was thinking; am surprised it took this long to suggest it.

Great stuff, looks good and is still made in the US.

Mark in Oregon

I’ve never heard of Rail Zip. What’s that?  What does it do?  Available where?  Online I suppose.  

I believe I’ll stick with tubular, but I will investigate gargraves.  

Rail Zip 2 on amazon for more info

https://www.amazon.com/Pacer-T...aps%2C149&sr=8-1

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but are you going to do any switching on your layout? I have a small layout so the loop is not super exciting. I like to do car movement/switching to spice things up and have lots of spurs and the Atlas uncoupling buttons around the track. These work really well with all of the different types of 3R couplers if the couplers are functioning properly. For other track types (Fastrack and Gargraves, etc.) I don't know what is used or how well it works compared to Atlas. If you're not going to do any switching or car connects/disconnects then it's not a consideration.

Guess I’ll get some Rail Zip

@AlanWSNC posted:

I’ve never heard of Rail Zip. What’s that?  What does it do?  Available where?  Online I suppose.  

I believe I’ll stick with tubular, but I will investigate gargraves.  

Well if your going to go that route then, I would suggest there pre formed curves.  Gargraves flex track is nice, but you need to bend it to create curves which can be somewhat difficult if your new at it.

Also look into Ross trackage all there curves are pre formed, no bending needed.

One other suggestion, since you tack your track down to a wooded board, why take the track apart every year just put the board away with the track on it that way all you have to do is spray a little WD 40 on it for storage and wipe it off with denatured alcohol the next time your ready to use.

No loose pins or need to pinch the track to make tighter connections.

You have given me some food for thought regarding permanently attaching portions of my track payout to the plywood. But it occurred to me that the plywood is first covered with a white bed sheet which is washed every year after the track is taken up. And it always needs a washing.

You guys are giving me good info and different ideas to consider. It is much appreciated from a novice as compared to you “old railroaders”.

No switching. Just a couple loops.

If you're looking to keep the same aesthetic that you've had all these years, check out this forum sponsor - https://www.tinman3rail.com/pr...an-3-rail/027-track/

@AlanWSNC posted:

You have given me some food for thought regarding permanently attaching portions of my track payout to the plywood. But it occurred to me that the plywood is first covered with a white bed sheet which is washed every year after the track is taken up. And it always needs a washing.

You guys are giving me good info and different ideas to consider. It is much appreciated from a novice as compared to you “old railroaders”.

You can always paint the board white.....No sheet needed.

I use fastrack for my permanent and Christmas tree layout. I've never broken a piece at the connections. YMMV.

Thanks. I’m aware of Tinman. I sold them a couple manual switches a few years ago.