Pictures of Lionel General

It is a big improvement.  I like the colors much more, and the wood load looks realistic stacked like that and that high.  

Not counting the newest Lionel General's as I do not own one but understand they are much better........THE best thing about General's are they are cheap!!!!

My Christmas Lionel General was $89 new in box. 

And as it did not run real well....I decided it would become my Toy Story II loco.

Altering the cab front REALLY helped the looks....but still ran like new! Repainted the loco, rebuilt the tender and added real wood load. Custom decals finished it.

I'd like a scale General, Rail King level of detail and price. Otherwise my General will be a display loco.

did you do a video of the changes?  would be nice to see.

I didn't take a video. I gave up on pictures 11 months ago. I did put the add-on piping on after the above photo's were taken. I was going for a highly modified General.

Bought a bunch of parts from Lionel, including a straight smokestack, only to find out the whole smoke unit had to be changed out. I need a couple more parts to finish it up, but with the price of shipping, and the average/poor running characteristics of the engine, It's probably about done.

Since the railroad I model (Colorado Midland) used mainly 4-6-0's, I'm changing my attention to the Williams engine, which is a pretty good match. The General is an ongoing project, but will probably never be completed to the way I want it. I'm just glad it's running at this point.

What you did helped a lot.  I agree that the Lionel General's price point is the best thing about them - I regard them only as a starting point for a good model.

The Lincoln Funeral train loco is the only Lionel product I know that is scale and close to the General.  I have one. It is amazingly tiny - because the actual loco was very early, very small.  It has no e-unit, no normal couplers,is all or mostly brass and very delicate.  I would not recommend even trying to do anything with that.  Mostly it impresses me with the challenge one would have making a "full featured" model of locos from that era: there is not a lot of room.  Frankly I'd come at it by using electronics and such meant for HO: you'd have more liklihood of getting stuff that would fit inside the tender.

Still waiting for a top-notch detailed General to be made.

Still waiting for a top-notch detailed General to be made.

There are lots of nicer 4-4-0s than the basic Lionel/MTH "creations" out there, by multiple builders (Lionel's "Lincoln" set, MTH's 999, anything by SMR).  Its just a matter of whether you are willing to pay for quality. 

If you are looking for a detailed American-type loco cheap, you are going to be waiting for a long time.  Man up and cough up the bucks or try to make due by modification like some of the others do.  Simple, eh?

On another subject, regarding adding a wood load... the large wood load as seen on the basic Lionel and MTH Americans is unrealistic in that they are based upon the fake wood load created for the GENERAL in 1960.  This load was made oversized to hide the oil fuel tank (the GENERAL was converted to run on oil at the time).  Properly, the fuel should not cover the entire tank as it blocks the fireman's ability to fill it with water.  The fake wood load on the GENERAL actually had a camouflaged hatch which could be lifted up to allow the filling of fuel oil or water as needed.

Very simple indeed........

Why do I have to MAN UP and pay over $1000 for a decent American in scale????

If Bachmann can do this for well under $200 why can't MTH, Lionel or even WbB do it???

A decent early American 4-4-0 with Rail King detail level should be a no brainer!

We get era correct freight and passenger cars and cabooses.....so why not??

Don't tell me they are too small either. I did not know Lionel's Lincoln funeral train loco did not have a reverse unit.......there is not reason for that...A Dallee unit can be made to fit any loco. I'm not going to pay the big bucks yet....no reason to IMHO.

Back on topic.........

something like this in scale.......easy to do....

Thank you. I hesitated to reply that I needed to spend a grand to be a "Man", to acquire and have quality items. For a moment there I thought I might not meet the criteria of a "O" scaler, or Forum member.

Typical.  Read half the comment and fly off the handle.  More products of public education, I guess.

Let me point out the full statement:

If you are looking for a detailed American-type loco cheap, you are going to be waiting for a long time.  Man up and cough up the bucks or try to make due by modification like some of the others do.  Simple, eh?

I didn't say you had to spend money to be a man.  Just either do that or "MAKE DUE BY MODIFICATION LIKE SOME OF THE OTHERS DO".

In other words, STOP WHINING AND DO SOMETHING.  That's the problem with too many of you - a bunch of spoiled whiners...  "boo hoo hooo!  Why can't X make exactly what I want now!  I'm going to hold my breath until I turn blue!  THAT WILL FIX YOU!"

What's the matter?  Scared to pick up a paint brush or kit bash or modify to what you want?  This thread is about a guy who did just that.  And bravo to him.

I will answer this directly to you. You don't know me personal, nor do I you. What and how much I spend, or what I'm capable of doing, kitbashing, etc.. Yet, you quickly make judgement, including a persons disposition, and call it whining. I guess its true, forums are easy to hide behind and show true colors. 

Best, I stay from hereforth as an observer, which worked great for months before.

I see, and read many great things here. So to those that love trains and "O" keep up the good work.

For Dave, I feel sorry for you.

Nice looking! I've been thinking about getting one but I don't want to spend a lot but I don't want cheap either. What's out there that fits that criteria?

You sure improved the looks from the original....great job!

Alan

I think the "revised" Generals shown here are superb, both brr's (I particularly love the wood and the way it is stacked, which looks very much like it does in old photos), and AMCDave's, who always does spectacular work.  

The photos below shos the challenge these early locos provide in trying to model them in scale.  In the first photo, that is a scale Lincoln Funeral Train loco on the left and a rather tattered General on the right.  It has a tiny motor in it, a switch somewhere for F-R (I think, I could not find it just now), no e-unit, no smoke, no regular couplers, and no sound at all. It is a beautiful detailed model but a lousy toy locmotive.

The second photo shows the smallest "full featured" (e-unit, cruise, chuffing, smoke, etc. ) steam loco I have, a lovely little MTH Premier 2-8-0. Quite impressive to get all that, and enough weight and motor in it that it pulls very well, into such a compact little body and tender.   Still, when it runs you can hear the small size of the speaker in the loco's rather high, tinny chuffing - but it is still a very cool little loco. 

Thanks for those pics Lee.....

I'd like a modern 4-4-0.....locos used well into 1920's-30's.....a little larger than the Lincoln era American. Think NYC 999 generic Rail King detail and price.

Were there any 4-4-0s used into the 1930s, or even 1920s?  Worley's ATSF book lists all ever used on the ATSF system as "out by 1900."  steamlocomotive.com says that because the firebox had to be narrow (to fit between the drivers) they were limited on power and thus superceded on just about every RR by 1900.  A ton of RRs had them so maybe someone used one.  

I have MTH's 999 BTW - it is a bit bigger than the 2-8-0 above, and a nice loco and about the best 4-4-0 I know of.  It is the one Premier model I have had problems with.  Chuffing works on some days, does not on others, and I can not find the problem.  One could take a 999 - particularly the version with the smaller driver size , and repaint, modify stack and pipes and such, and make it look more "1920s" I suppose.

A few roads used 4-4-0's fairly late in the steam era, Frisco and L&N come to mind.

it would be great of Bachmann did their HO 4-4-0 and 2-6-0 in O scale....

Jeff C

MTH could probably use the HO PS-3 electronics in a scale American 3-rail locomotive.  The electronics would have to be modified to use AC and 3-rail rollers would need to be installed.

I have a couple K-Line porters.  K-Line solved the claw coupler problem by using HO Kadee style couplers on this model.  K-Line made matching ore cars with Kadee style HO couplers. I run this train all the time.

I think that this could be done.  I wonder if there is a large enough market for such a small engine and train to make it happen?  Was Lionel's Stephen's Rocket set a big seller? 

Joe

WbB is my hope!!!!! I love the 4-6-0.....and looking at their line.....4-4-0's are in every other scale!!

Posterize much?

Putting bugs in the manufacturer/importer's ears on what they would like to have made is doing something.  Not everyone in the hobby has the aptitude, or the time, to kitbash or scratchbuild, let alone do so where the end results look professional or perhaps satisfactory to the person doing it, and I think it's rather presumptuous to assume everyone can.

I have an old brass Williams AC-12 cab forward on the shelf that I bought over 6 years ago with the intention of super-detailing it to make it look more prototypically accurate, and I only got about 5% of what I wanted to get done accomplished between then and now.  I work full-time, and have two small kids at home and lots of non-train activities and commitments to fulfill.  The little myself time that I have, I'd rather use running my trains and working on getting the layout scenery completed.  Since getting myself the scale Lionel cab forward (2005 release) added to my roster, I no longer have a need to super-detail the Williams version, other than just to say I did, which doesn't amount to much for me right now.

In answer to the original post, the results look great.  Have you considered swapping out the existing roller bearing trucks on the tender with Lionel's arch bar trucks so it's less anachronistic?