no response legacy engine

See if you pinched a wire during reassembly... I have done that before... something is grounding out the signal...

6-34598 isn't a valid Lionel locomotive number.

John ,i went & checked my parts list that i had printed out for this engine & the dummy unit & it is correct ,the number for the dummy unit is 6-34599 ,powered unit is 6-34598 .

Lionel or Google never heard of a Lionel locomotive with that number.

Perhaps you could just describe what Legacy engine you have and someone could try to figure it out from there ?

Steam or Diesel ?

Style, like 2-6-0 or F3 ?

Railroad Name ?

Road Number ?

This came up...

https://www.trainz.com/product...?variant=40955483462

OK ,I found where i made my mistake on the engine number,i found the original receipt & the number is 6-34568 ,but the when i went to the lionel web site last year to get the parts breakdown is where i got the 6-34 598 number from as you can see from the pictures ,sorry about that i screwed up ,i seem to be doing a lot of that lately. CJACK ,That is the board i have ,i printed the picture out & i went downstairs & compared it to the one i have , i don't see any pinched wires but i am going to take another close look ,also the antenna wire is still connected to the plate on the roof of the shell .I did pull the antenna harness out several times so i could move the out of my way i don't know if i could have damaged the wire while doing that & there is only one wire in that harness . If i have to replace that board i am not sure it's within my ability ,although i may be able to do it if i put the new board right next to my old one and pull one harness out at a time & plug it into the new one ,but first i need to know if the problem is the board itself ,so what is my next move ?

I went down to the layout to see if there was any change to my problem i powered up the track & the engine started right up ,i was using the cab-1 ,i pressed the horn buton & the engine responded ,i then turned the throttle & it responded & it went around the track one time ,then i put the cab-1 down i got the cab-2 out to see if it responded to it ,turned it on entered the id # ,nothing no response at all,shut cab-2 off pick up cab-1 now no response to that either ,this makes no sense to me ,does this tell you anything new about what the problem could be ?

Try changing the engine type in the CAB2 to TMCC or CAB1 and see if it then works.  It sounds like the engine is not responding to Legacy commands.

Of course, first question would be does the Legacy system work with other Legacy locomotives!

John ,I got it to work fine in conventioal mode ,i can control the horn & bell with the cab-1 but nothing else ,what i did notice that when i powered up the track it started up right away but it did not move in either direction until i pressed the direction button ,which i thought was odd given that conventional engines take right off as soon as power is applied to the track ,but it does work fine anyway in conventional mode .I couldn't do anything with the cab-2 ,nothing at all with this engine & the rest of my legacy engones work fine on all 4 of my loops . For some reason i am feeling that i may be able to find the problem myself with the help from members on the forum ,i could be wrong about this but something keeps telling me to keep trying. So we know the engine isn't getting the legacy signal ,or if it is then maybe something on the board isn't working ,any suggestions on what i could do next ?

I think it's time to try the locomotive on another layout with Legacy.

I'll defer to John as the expert and agree that testing on another Legacy layout would help.

If all the other Legacy engines work, it seems to me that pretty much eliminates the command base, track and Cab-2 remote as the cause of the problem and leaves only that the engine is either not properly programmed into the remote (unlikely since the other engines seem to be ok) or that the engine is either not properly receiving the Legacy signal or not properly processing it. Does that sound right ?

Since something was already noted about the antenna wire, I'd start there and make sure that the wire is properly seated in the plug/harness and not pulled out and that there are no cuts or breaks  or bare wire.

Richie C. The engine was properly programmed into the remote because it was fine for years until i was working on the smoke unit thats when all the problems started ,as far as the antenna goes i did unplug the harness several times so l could  move the shell out of my way ,you mentioned making sure the antenna wire is properly seated which i also was concerned about ,my question is can i pull the antenna wire out of the harness to check & see what it looks like without doing any damage ?

     John ,I don't know who near me that even has a legacy or any o scale setup ,so that is not an option right now ,but i will ask around .

do you get any response by putting your hand over the engine?

BIGDODGETRAIN, No i get no response  by putting my hand over the engine  not even with a ground plane wire running along the track .

This is a long shot, but make sure the brake slider on the cab 2 is in the up / off position when you select this engine.

Bruce

Bruce ,Thanks for the suggestion ,the brake slider is all the way up.

Well, given the history of having it apart, it's probably indeed something inside the engine.  At this point, I think it's time for you to take this to a Lionel tech and have them get it running.

Have you swapped the RCMC with one from another Legacy engine?  Sounds may differ slightly, but you should get the same motive response.  Be careful though, it's a $120 board.  Pretty inexpensive to send just the RCMC board to  Lionel repair or an authorized repair shop for testing.  Plenty of sources on this forum.

Bruce

Send it to Lionel for testing. Not sure how many if any service stations have test jigs for RCMC boards nor can many even order RCMC boards without a trade in.  Don't swap boards with one from a good engine. There is more than one version of RCMC board.

Pete

Gunrunnerjohn, I wish Alex M. was still in New York ,he was only 30 minutes away since he moved he is a longer distance now, him i could trust 100% to work on my engines ,as he has done work for me before .Let me ask your opinion on what i have been thinking ,is it worth it for me to replace the board that CJACK posted above myself ,is it just a matter of unpluging the wire harness's from the old board & pluging them into the new board ,or is there more to it than that ?

Gotta' go with Pete on this one, don't take good parts out of another engine, too much potential for having two dead engines!

Gerald, I really think you need to get this in the hands of someone that can actually diagnose what is going on, you don't really want to buy a $120 board if you don't have to.  Also, if it's something about the installation that got compromised and it takes out the new RCMC, you'd really be unhappy!

John ,I will not attempt to change the board myself ,i was thinking along the same lines as you myself ,at least now it runs perfect in conventional mode with horn & bell working from the cab-1, i can turn the smoke unit on & off from the switch on the engine,  i can't access the legacy features right now ,but if i attempt to change the board myself not only could i ruin a new board ,something may happen that i won't be able to run it in conventional mode so if i decide i want to access the legacy features i will get in touch with Alex & see if he would be able to fix it for me .   You mentioned something about checking it with a meter ,i have 2 multi meters ,one is a standard radio shack probably around $20.00 ,the other is a better one my brother in law gave me ,he is an electrician by trade ,i would like to do that if you could tell me how & what to check ,i don't think i could cause any more damage with the meters than i already have ,i would appreciate it very much .

                                           Thanks ,Gerald 

I'd let Alex have a crack at it.

If it runs in conventional it may just be the receiver board. Thats a small board that plugs into the RCMC. It may also be a loose connector that drives the tether. You can check these connections visually if you want but without knowing what should be there using a meter won't help much. The tether connector is a small two pin connector near the receiver board.  Its also close to the connector for the smoke unit. Maybe you disturbed it when working on your smoke unit. Lionel is pretty stingy on giving out info on these boards even to their field techs. Hopefully Alex can help you.

Pete 

John ,Thanks for all your help ,you have been very patient with me & that means a lot to me i really do appreciate that ,for now i will just leave it alone ,i may just look it over to see if i could have missed something & i want to look at the antenna wire that is connected to a 2 pin harness ,i can't tell if there is a problem with the part of the wire that goes into the 2 pin harness ,i don't know if i can replace that harness itself ,i'm sure that one of the electrical supply companys may have that type of harness ,other than that i am going to leave it alone for now .

     Pete ,If  by 2 pin tether connector you mean the wire that runs from the roof of the shell to a 2 pin harness ,i have pulled it out several times so i could move the shell out of my way ,thats the harness i want to replace if i can ,other than that i don't have the knowledge to go any further .

The two pin connector is routed to the wireless tether in a steam engine. I have not had a Legacy diesel apart but it may go directly to the audio board in a diesel. It carries serial data. Its located between the receiver board and the connectors for the fan smoke units near the center of the board side to side.

Pete

There is no problem swapping RCMC boards.  I have done it many time. Different codes may effect lighting and such, but it is a sound method to isolate board versus Chassis and wiring.  You need to take a picture of wire connector to board thought to help, unless your use to doing repairs.  That board comes out very easy with one screw once the wires removed.

No different than swapping and R2LC or a RS board.  Sometimes even with TMCC you need to pull out a MB to figure it out.  The RCMC is so much easier to work with since only one screw.  TMCC mother boards a whole nother pain.  G

George, the issue in swapping the RCMC is if there is a short or other wiring fault that has taken the first one out.   Also, it's easy for you or I to recommend operations like swapping out boards with lots of connections as we do it all the time.  I'm very hesitant to suggest it to someone that doesn't feel comfortable doing it.

John ,i fully understand your reluctance to recommend changeing boards to someone like me who has no knowledge or experience with electronics ,sometimes you could do more damage than what has been already  done ,i did unseat that small board from the rcmc ,just to make sure it was properly seated & i did notice there was only one screw holding the board in & if i was going to try & remove the board i would have done what GGG had suggested ,take a good picture of where the wires are plugged into ,but i don't see me doing anything with the rcmc board ,i will admit i have given some thought to replacing the smaller board which is very easy to do ,but i do realise that i could lose the new smaller board if there is something else wrong & possibly losing the rcmc board if it isn't already lost ,the smaller board is much cheaper than the rcmc board i haven't made any decision on whether or not i wan't to take that chance ,if i do go ahead & replace the smaller board hopeing it is the answer to my problem & it doesn't workout then at least i could say i tried ,& from that point forward i know i shouldn't be messing around with electronic boards ,if i do go ahead with this i will post the results ,good ,or bad .

Pete was implying you can't do it because of software.  Also, you always risk damage a good with a bad swap, yet you must do it to half the problem.  After inspecting everything to ensure no faults.

Frankly if it runs in conventional, as he said, then I doubt it will short.  I agree it can just be the radio.

As far as connectors, they are different, other than the smoke spot and the power in.  I leave it to the person working on it to determine their comfort level.  G

I just wanted to report that i decided to pull the radio board & send it to lionel for testing & they said it would cost  $ 20.00 & if it was good then that is all it would cost  & if bad then i would have to buy a new one ,as it turned out the board was damaged so ordered a new one hopeing that there wasn't anything else wrong with the engine  got the new board ,put it in & everything worked normal ,i could not have done this without the help of the forum members ,thanks to all who responded .